It is currently Sun Apr 20, 2014 1:37 am



Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 904 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18 ... 37  Next
 The Golden Thread, Volume 5.4 2010 
Author Message
Truth Seeker
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2009 8:31 am
Posts: 56
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Like I said...they should have surrendered


rutsuyasun wrote:
Excerpts from Institute for Historical Review
Why the Atomic Bombings Could Have Been Avoided
Was Hiroshima Necessary?

Quote:
Japan Seeks Peace

Months before the end of the war, Japan's leaders recognized that defeat was inevitable. In April 1945 a new government headed by Kantaro Suzuki took office with the mission of ending the war..... American officials, having long since broken Japan's secret codes, knew from intercepted messages that the country's leaders were seeking to end the war on terms as favorable as possible......In mid-April [1945] the [US] Joint Intelligence Committee reported that Japanese leaders were looking for a way to modify the surrender terms to end the war. The State Department was convinced the Emperor was actively seeking a way to stop the fighting.


Quote:
..on January 20, 1945,.... President Roosevelt received a 40-page memorandum from General Douglas MacArthur outlining five separate surrender overtures from high-level Japanese officials.....This memo showed that the Japanese were offering surrender terms virtually identical to the ones ultimately accepted by the Americans at the formal surrender ceremony on September 2


Quote:
Peace Overtures

In April and May 1945, Japan made three attempts through neutral Sweden and Portugal to bring the war to a peaceful end.....By mid-June, six members of Japan's Supreme War Council had secretly charged Foreign Minister Shigenori Togo with the task of approaching Soviet Russia's leaders "with a view to terminating the war if possible by September.....By early July the US had intercepted messages from Togo to the Japanese ambassador in Moscow, Naotake Sato, showing that the Emperor himself was taking a personal hand in the peace effort, and had directed that the Soviet Union be asked to help end the war.....


Quote:
Summarizing the messages between Togo and Sato (in July), US naval intelligence said that Japan's leaders, "though still balking at the term unconditional surrender," recognized that the war was lost, and had reached the point where they have "no objection to the restoration of peace on the basis of the [1941] Atlantic Charter." These messages, said Assistant Secretary of the Navy Lewis Strauss, "indeed stipulated only that the integrity of the Japanese Royal Family be preserved."


Quote:
Authoritative Voices of Dissent

American leaders who were in a position to know the facts did not believe, either at the time or later, that the atomic bombings were needed to end the war......

Eisenhower: "Japan was already defeated and that dropping the bomb was completely unnecessary."

Brig. General Bonnie Fellers: ... "Neither the atomic bombing nor the entry of the Soviet Union into the war forced Japan's unconditional surrender. She was defeated before either these events took place."

Admiral Leahy, Chief of Staff to presidents Roosevelt and Truman: " It is my opinion that the use of the barbarous weapon at Hiroshima and Nagasaki was of no material assistance in our war against Japan ... The Japanese were already defeated and ready to surrender."


Quote:
US Strategic Bombing Survey Verdict

After studying this matter in great detail, the United States Strategic Bombing Survey rejected the notion that Japan gave up because of the atomic bombings. In its authoritative 1946 report, the Survey concluded:

"The Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombs did not defeat Japan, nor by the testimony of the enemy leaders who ended the war did they persuade Japan to accept unconditional surrender. The Emperor, the Lord Privy Seal, the Prime Minister, the Foreign Minister, and the Navy Minister had decided as early as May of 1945 that the war should be ended even if it meant acceptance of defeat on allied terms ..."


http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v16/v16n3p-4_Weber.html


Sat Jun 12, 2010 10:55 pm
Profile
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 13, 2009 9:13 pm
Posts: 217
Location: Wet coast
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Like Ruts suggested with his post, there was another way.

Over 200 000 people died as a result of not trying the other way. We are talking about babies, brothers, sisters, wives and husbands.

The only good I can see that came of those events is that the trigger happy dudes making the decisions for the countries having the nukes have hesitated to press the button in the last 55 years, knowing what the horrible result is.


Sat Jun 12, 2010 11:15 pm
Profile ICQ YIM
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 13, 2009 9:13 pm
Posts: 217
Location: Wet coast
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Actually, make that 65 years. (I'm weak at math.)

If one of those 200 000 dead from the 2 atomic bombs was someone you loved, I doubt you would have said they should have surrendered.

You might have been more focused on expressing your rage at the death of your loved ones.


Sat Jun 12, 2010 11:55 pm
Profile ICQ YIM
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 11:07 am
Posts: 102
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
The fact that our species continues to use physical violence against each other is just one reflection of where we are in our spiritual evolution.

Other illustrations include our continuing to see each other as separate because of our national origin, skin color, sexual orientation, economic or social position with the power structure, blah blah blah.

It is all quite pathetic.

_________________
"The only thing we found that makes the emptiness bearable is................... each other."

From the movie "Contact"

Shawnna's Reality


Sun Jun 13, 2010 9:43 am
Profile
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 11:40 am
Posts: 867
Location: Eastern England
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Siam wrote:
I just spent a couple of hours listening to Lindsey Williams on the Alex Jones Show. Wow gas at 6-8 dollars a gallon!!! by the end of summer? I think maybe we should buy scooters!!

They are seriously considering nuking the gulf, and if the strata, that they broke into has really fractured, look out World, your going to get really dirty and soon!! If they screw up the nuking, that strata will crack further and will flow oil until the end of the world.

One thing I learned is that while the sea floor is 5,000 feet down, they drilled another 25,000 feet into the sea bed. That they are leaking about 4 million barrels a day.
But most important is that while they show the so called leak on camera, that one is only about 4-5 feet tall. The main flow loss is about 6 miles away, and NOAA has found another plume of oil 20 miles away.

It looks like the well casing/bore may have been pierced and badly damaged a couple of thousand feet below the sea floor, so that might explain why the so-called "top kill" was such a non-event.

If oil is seeping up at different places along the sea floor, then drilling a relief well and filling it with mud and concrete won't work. The US government will have to take charge of the situation if this is the case and use their military and engineering might -- the reason they haven't up until now is because they don't want to accept any financial liabilities for the disaster in the Gulf.


Sun Jun 13, 2010 10:43 am
Profile
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 11:40 am
Posts: 867
Location: Eastern England
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Dondep wrote:
However, I doubt very much the Great Oil Spill occurred intentionally, at least by the intentions of the elite. BP is in danger of going down in bankruptcy, and leaving millions of British pensioners out in the cold, literally. Whatever profit they made from the rigs before is now going straight out the door to the ruined lives of those who once depended on the Gulf's economy. Tony Hayward may just go out the door, as a sacrificial lamb, for all the invective that's been hurled his way. Maybe he knew that by cutting corners as his people were, he was going to lose any profit he might have gained, so he dumped £1.4 million worth of his own stock in BP just days before the Big Spill. He and Goldman Sucks certainly didn't LOSE money, in their stock portfolios, but the company (BP) may die shortly, and the gov't. will have to wade in and clean up the mess they left if they can't finish the job.

I've read about 18 million people in the UK either own BP shares or pay into pension plans that have BP shares in their portfolios, the latter which probably accounts for about 1/7th of their "pension pot" in total. So even if BP sinks without trace, those people in their 40s and 50s who are regularly paying into their private pensions now won't exactly live in penury in retirement, but they certainly won't be holding Barrack Obama in high esteem in their old age. Even millions of folks in North America who either hold stocks in BP or are paying into pension plans will be affected by all this, unless BP can miraculously turn this disaster around.

On the media, BP's Chief Executive Tony Hayward has come across as something of a twat (to clarify, that's British slang for idiot ;) ) and personally I'm amazed he's still in his job. In fact, how did he ever become CEO in the first place? Okay, he's not personally to blame for the oil disaster, but that's no excuse for his dire handling of the situation in the 'States. Recently, one American chap I know personally blamed the UK for the disaster, saying that British Petroleum is a British company and so the UK should pay for the consequences of the oil catastrophe in the GoM. I understood his anger, and told him that BP ceased being called British Petroleum a long time ago because the company had merged with US giant Amoco (used to be Rockefeller's "Standard Oil" back in the mists of time), gone multi-national and changed their name to Beyond Petroleum (crap name, I know). Also, it was mainly American workers of BP, Halliburton and Transocean who ply their trades in the Gulf of Mexico who had messed up -- that's if it was an accident and not sabotage, of course.


Sun Jun 13, 2010 10:59 am
Profile
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 11:40 am
Posts: 867
Location: Eastern England
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Shawnna wrote:
The fact that our species continues to use physical violence against each other is just one reflection of where we are in our spiritual evolution.

Other illustrations include our continuing to see each other as separate because of our national origin, skin color, sexual orientation, economic or social position with the power structure, blah blah blah.

It is all quite pathetic.

Yeah, it is.

That's why disclosure isn't on the horizon for some time to come, that's if we make it through the next decade or three.


Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:34 am
Profile
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2009 8:59 am
Posts: 6363
Location: Friendswood, TX
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Quote:
Regarding the Atomic bomb...it was a difficult decision, but one that was made to end the war and save American lives.

Japan was given the opportunity to surrender on numerous occasions but refused.

Japan started that war, and would not have surrendered without the atomic bomb.

The invasion of Japan would have cost millions of lives on both sides.....and in that respect, the atomic bomb saved more lives than it took.


Mur - I have to agree with you for you see my father was on a ship near Okinawa and was practising running a landing craft up a river in Japan when the first bomb was dropped.

They were told to expect 90% casulaties. Yes that is right - 90%. He said when the war with Japan was declared over - men jumped off ships into the sea and the large guns opened up and sprayed the night sky. He said at that moment he knew exactly what Francis Scott Key meant by "bombs bursting in air."

I remember this conversation with him vividly because I was shocked and angry when I learned about dropping the bombs on Japan in school. As most my age (a boomer), I grew up with the threat of nuclear war and I could not understand why anyone would murder innocent civilians in this way.

He was very much in favor of doing anything it took to end the war in the Pacific for you see he ran landing craft at Iwo Jima and Okinawa. He was the only non-commissioned officer allowed to carry a side arm because had a Marine balked it was his responsibility to shoot him for treason. What a weight to place on a 19-20 year old's shoulders, huh?

But I think we can look back now and see that it was a terrible, terrible thing we unleashed on the world. Would the Japanese have surrendered without the first bomb on August 7th? No one will ever know. The Japanese gobmit chose to place their citizens at risk rather than abiding by the terms of the Potsdam Declaration.

From Wikipedia:
The Potsdam Declaration or the Proclamation Defining Terms for Japanese Surrender is a statement calling for the Surrender of Japan in World War II. On July 26, 1945, United States President Harry S. Truman, United Kingdom Prime Minister Winston Churchill, and President of the Republic of China Chiang Kai-Shek issued the document, which outlines the terms of surrender for the Empire of Japan as agreed upon at the Potsdam Conference. This ultimatum stated that, if Japan did not surrender, it would face "prompt and utter destruction".

Japan's initial rejection of the ultimatum led directly to Truman's decision to drop atomic bombs on the Japanese cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki on August 6 and August 9. Whether the ultimatum was intended to be acceptable without recourse to use nuclear weapons has been subject to considerable debate.

The declaration was one of Churchill's final official acts as Prime Minister before he left office the following day in favour of Clement Attlee.

_________________
The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little. - FDR


Sun Jun 13, 2010 2:05 pm
Profile
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 9:31 pm
Posts: 2269
Location: Bolton Point N.S.W. (AUS)
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Ocean existed on Mars- study

Monday, June 14, 2010 » 06:24am

New research suggests a vast Earth-like ocean covered a third of the surface of Mars three and a half billion years ago.

Scientists believe it stretched around the planet's northern hemisphere and held 10 times more water than all the Earth's oceans combined.

It may also have provided a cradle for the emergence of extraterrestrial life.

Scientists have long debated whether oceans,seas, lakes or rivers existed on Mars eons ago.

The new research published in the journal Nature Geoscience provides the best evidence yet that an enormous ocean once existed on Mars.

_________________
I am a Highly Strung Prima Donna(atari)


Sun Jun 13, 2010 2:40 pm
Profile YIM
Truth Seeker
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2009 10:44 am
Posts: 17
Location: london
Post Re: New Chemtrails and a 7.5 EQ
Dondep wrote:
Glad I somehow missed the ugliness last night when I posted my comment to Midnight. Sad, and ironic too; a courtesy leads to a misunderstanding, provoking an ugly outburst of resentment, and then the festering sore is sent far and wide on an email list where most recipients are probably going "huh?" And yet, here we have a regular emoticon, clearly demonstrating the smoking of a 'joint', which was only a disguise for disgruntlement over feeling slighted: :yamon OMG! Better alert the FBI! Emoticons are encouraging the use of ganja! I would be LMFAO if it wasn't such a tragic commentary


Seeing as youre making a meal of this, ill say = Above you say its {qu.} "the smoking of a "joint"" {unqu.}, but in ur mail to me you say {qu,} "I never even considered it might be a joint; it's a damn cigarette!" {unqu.}..always remember what you say, and remember your story!
And my good acquaintances on my list that ive been conversing with for ages that i sent that info about the avatar to definatly did not scratch their heads and say "huh". Quite the opposite. The replies i got were interesting, but they knew already the methods used.Theyre always interested in government "tracking sites" as their dubiously titled,and their methods, and yes my friends did see it as promotion of drug abuse in that avator.What a coincidence.I cant go into all the ins and outs of what was said but little messages like you are sending out are a slap in the face to every drug rehab agency in the world. Cannabis is not totally legal everywhere at the moment and a common argument used is that it leads the user on to harder stuff, and a lot of people know thats true. But what do you care? You dont realise your govt. are the biggest drug dealers on earth, but youre not bothered about that either. Try and catch up with whats important.
And ive told you already = i dont care if you ban me at all. This place obviously plays a large part in your life so you think telling me that has some value, but it hasnt. There are real things happening in this world that should be paid attention to,and id rather be on sites that report that.Sites like this exist to draw peoples attention away from those things. However, noone can tell u anything, and youre probably out of your head most of the time so even if they did it wouldnt sink in.Pointless continuing really in that case. Ill check back in a month as youll probably have to answer. Its so boring. What would you do if someone used a pic as an avator of someone smoking a great big fat spliff - an obvious joint. Would you ban them? Not if theyre a moderator he says.Cos it seems the odd swear word gets one banned, but pics of drug abuse doesnt. Very weird principles here.

_________________
PEACE


Sun Jun 13, 2010 4:08 pm
Profile
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 8:54 am
Posts: 4711
Location: Canada
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Butlincat you don't have to read here if you don't want to that's YOUR choice!!!

As for your friend saying that we promote drup use and that we are Government plants, I think your buddy needs to seek new employment cause he is clearly in the wrong business :crazy

_________________
Image
Image Please Obey the Golden Rules viewtopic.php?f=31&t=3563&p=40912#p40912


Sun Jun 13, 2010 4:22 pm
Profile WWW
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 13, 2009 9:13 pm
Posts: 217
Location: Wet coast
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Actually, if Dondep's avatar showed a guy smoking a cigarette, as opposed to a joint, it would be presenting a significantly more dangerous image.

Tobacco has killed many millions, whereas there is no evidence that pot kills anybody.

A lot of people see the hypocrisy in how the law treats those two substances.


Sun Jun 13, 2010 4:24 pm
Profile ICQ YIM
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 8:54 am
Posts: 4711
Location: Canada
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
My appologies to UJ and Wiz I forgot about you two guys & your avatars, sorry about that :embarressed

_________________
Image
Image Please Obey the Golden Rules viewtopic.php?f=31&t=3563&p=40912#p40912


Sun Jun 13, 2010 4:30 pm
Profile WWW
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2008 9:36 am
Posts: 468
Location: Montreal
Post Re: New Chemtrails and a 7.5 EQ
butlincat wrote:
You dont realise your govt. are the biggest drug dealers on earth, but youre not bothered about that either. Try and catch up with whats important.


Are you kidding me ? Everybody knows that ! That's common knowledge.

butlincat wrote:
[...] There are real things happening in this world that should be paid attention to,and id rather be on sites that report that. Sites like this exist to draw peoples attention away from those things.


Yeah I agree. I hate those who draw people attention away from those important things.

Like that one guy I remember. He came by an old forum and feriously complaint about someone's avatar... he claims that avatar was outrageous, because it shows a cigarette or a joint. In the meantime, people were discussing important stuff, like the oil leak in the golf of Mexico (i.e. the greatest environment disaster of the our record history), the moral dilemma of the US bombing of Hiroshima & Nagasaki (which is still a very debating issue), some high level corruption with powerful corporations (Goldman Sachs for example) and a multitude of other important subjects...

But that guy... he just kept bashing about that avatar even thought no one cares because it was an insignificant subject to begin with and his complaint that it was promoting drug uses was ludicrous....and boring. Yet he kept arguing and insulting people rather than discuss real things happening in this world that should be paid attention to. :shakehead

Anyway, I never did understand that guy. Perhaps he had nothing better to do with his time.

_________________
De la laideur naîtra la beauté.


Sun Jun 13, 2010 5:59 pm
Profile
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2008 9:36 am
Posts: 468
Location: Montreal
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Shawnna wrote:
The fact that our species continues to use physical violence against each other is just one reflection of where we are in our spiritual evolution.

Other illustrations include our continuing to see each other as separate because of our national origin, skin color, sexual orientation, economic or social position with the power structure, blah blah blah.

It is all quite pathetic.


I agree. But the main reason we see each other as separate entity is because of the 4 dimension reality-illusion we live in.

_________________
De la laideur naîtra la beauté.


Sun Jun 13, 2010 6:06 pm
Profile
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 11:07 am
Posts: 102
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Cyberbird wrote:
Shawnna wrote:
The fact that our species continues to use physical violence against each other is just one reflection of where we are in our spiritual evolution.

Other illustrations include our continuing to see each other as separate because of our national origin, skin color, sexual orientation, economic or social position with the power structure, blah blah blah.

It is all quite pathetic.


I agree. But the main reason we see each other as separate entity is because of the 4 dimension reality-illusion we live in.


I disagree. The main reason we see each other as separate is because we choose to.

It's a choice.

_________________
"The only thing we found that makes the emptiness bearable is................... each other."

From the movie "Contact"

Shawnna's Reality


Sun Jun 13, 2010 7:52 pm
Profile
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2008 6:55 am
Posts: 2733
Location: 36 cliks N of 3030
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
May I suggest to the board to consider whether we have been inflicted by an act of "Trolling"? Followed by a persistent "drip" that only irritates you if you fail to deal with it.

Banning based on GT - rules is as handy as cleaning the bugs off you wind screen when it is necessary. There is another way to show the record that an irritation brought its own demise.

I respect the morality on GT and therefore like to spend some of my time here. I also like to just ignore issues that bother me, similarly to my experience when I post an item and it "seems" to be ignored. It has taught me to grow up a little more and be as objective in my experience here. Yes, we do choose and thus I close with a reminder:

"You only loose an argument when you have to go down to the level of the instigator"

I like the clear, objective thinking I read here mostly, so I choose to not engage in time wasteting arguments and look forward to the next interesting post.

I love getting value for my dollar and that's why I am member here at GT.



:why :agree :beer


:candle

_________________
We all have the choice to exercise free will.

"The mind is like a garden - if you do not cultivate it, you cannot harvest from it."

As above is Consciousness - So below is Matter


Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:34 pm
Profile
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2008 7:51 am
Posts: 154
Location: Switzerland
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Veritas Special Report - Sunday, June 13, 2010 with James Fox

Image

download mp3

New Spill Oil Photos - Oil Reaches Florida!



The Short Film BP Doesen't Want You To See


_________________
website: Information Machine


Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:35 pm
Profile
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2009 8:59 am
Posts: 6363
Location: Friendswood, TX
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Quote:
I disagree. The main reason we see each other as separate is because we choose to.

It's a choice.


I agree it is a choice that we make as individuals but it doesn't help when MSM and TPTB exploit this for their own advantage.

"Divide and conquer" has worked for eons and, unfortunately, it still does. Look at the news in this day and time. We're all pi$$ed off at the banks, corporations, senators, congress, etc.

Why? To a large degree because some of us believe they've received more than their fair share of the pot of money in the world. Like this "pot" is the magical pot at the end of the rainbow and is finite. :roll

This idealism, if you will, then becomes a distraction to the real issues in the world. Too many of us have sold our souls for RVs, Hummers, iPads and more.

Just gimme, gimme, gimme and I'll look the other way while the rape and pillage of our Earth continues. :rant

I'm just as guilty of this as the next person, too, and I hate it! When I find myself salivating over the latest "toy" I am beginning to ask why? Why do I need this? Does it bring joy in my life?

Most of the time the answer is no. Sadly, I realize I've fallen for some "marketing" scheme by a large corporation to make me part with my hard earned money and join the sheeple herd, AGAIN! :yamon

So I purchase this little gizmo and what happens? I immediately feel "superior" to the have nots because you see this little gizmo makes me a have. Because I am a have I can then look down on the have nots and gaily sing "I got mine!"

Nah ne nah ne boo boo! :sarcasism

_________________
The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little. - FDR


Mon Jun 14, 2010 6:31 am
Profile
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 10, 2009 6:06 am
Posts: 640
Location: Music of the Spheres
Post Re: New Chemtrails and a 7.5 EQ
Cyberbird wrote:
butlincat wrote:
[...] There are real things happening in this world that should be paid attention to,and id rather be on sites that report that. Sites like this exist to draw peoples attention away from those things.


Yeah I agree. I hate those who draw people attention away from those important things.

Like that one guy I remember. He came by an old forum and furiously complained about someone's avatar... he claims that avatar was outrageous, because it shows a cigarette or a joint. In the meantime, people were discussing important stuff, like the oil leak in the gulf of Mexico (i.e. the greatest environment disaster of our recorded history), the moral dilemma of the US bombing of Hiroshima & Nagasaki (which is still a very debating issue), some high level corruption with powerful corporations (Goldman Sachs for example) and a multitude of other important subjects...

But that guy... he just kept bashing about that avatar even though no one cares because it was an insignificant subject to begin with and his complaint that it was promoting drug uses was ludicrous....and boring. Yet he kept arguing and insulting people rather than discuss real things happening in this world that should be paid attention to. :shakehead

Anyway, I never did understand that guy. Perhaps he had nothing better to do with his time.



Yay, Cyberbird! :spit :spit :spit

Thanks for my morning laugh. You nailed it perfectly!

Cheers,

Selene

:banana :banana :banana


Mon Jun 14, 2010 9:13 am
Profile
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 9:38 pm
Posts: 2535
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
By JAMES RISEN
Published: June 13, 2010

WASHINGTON — The United States has discovered nearly $1 trillion in untapped mineral deposits in Afghanistan, far beyond any previously known reserves and enough to fundamentally alter the Afghan economy and perhaps the Afghan war itself, according to senior American government officials.

The previously unknown deposits — including huge veins of iron, copper, cobalt, gold and critical industrial metals like lithium — are so big and include so many minerals that are essential to modern industry that Afghanistan could eventually be transformed into one of the most important mining centers in the world, the United States officials believe.

An internal Pentagon memo, for example, states that Afghanistan could become the “Saudi Arabia of lithium,” a key raw material in the manufacture of batteries for laptops and BlackBerrys.

The vast scale of Afghanistan’s mineral wealth was discovered by a small team of Pentagon officials and American geologists. The Afghan government and President Hamid Karzai were recently briefed, American officials said.

While it could take many years to develop a mining industry, the potential is so great that officials and executives in the industry believe it could attract heavy investment even before mines are profitable, providing the possibility of jobs that could distract from generations of war.

“There is stunning potential here,” Gen. David H. Petraeus, commander of the United States Central Command, said in an interview on Saturday. “There are a lot of ifs, of course, but I think potentially it is hugely significant.”

The value of the newly discovered mineral deposits dwarfs the size of Afghanistan’s existing war-bedraggled economy, which is based largely on opium production and narcotics trafficking as well as aid from the United States and other industrialized countries. Afghanistan’s gross domestic product is only about $12 billion.

“This will become the backbone of the Afghan economy,” said Jalil Jumriany, an adviser to the Afghan minister of mines.

American and Afghan officials agreed to discuss the mineral discoveries at a difficult moment in the war in Afghanistan. The American-led offensive in Marja in southern Afghanistan has achieved only limited gains. Meanwhile, charges of corruption and favoritism continue to plague the Karzai government, and Mr. Karzai seems increasingly embittered toward the White House.

So the Obama administration is hungry for some positive news to come out of Afghanistan. Yet the American officials also recognize that the mineral discoveries will almost certainly have a double-edged impact.

Instead of bringing peace, the newfound mineral wealth could lead the Taliban to battle even more fiercely to regain control of the country.

The corruption that is already rampant in the Karzai government could also be amplified by the new wealth, particularly if a handful of well-connected oligarchs, some with personal ties to the president, gain control of the resources. Just last year, Afghanistan’s minister of mines was accused by American officials of accepting a $30 million bribe to award China the rights to develop its copper mine. The minister has since been replaced.

Endless fights could erupt between the central government in Kabul and provincial and tribal leaders in mineral-rich districts. Afghanistan has a national mining law, written with the help of advisers from the World Bank, but it has never faced a serious challenge.

“No one has tested that law; no one knows how it will stand up in a fight between the central government and the provinces,” observed Paul A. Brinkley, deputy undersecretary of defense for business and leader of the Pentagon team that discovered the deposits.

At the same time, American officials fear resource-hungry China will try to dominate the development of Afghanistan’s mineral wealth, which could upset the United States, given its heavy investment in the region. After winning the bid for its Aynak copper mine in Logar Province, China clearly wants more, American officials said.

Another complication is that because Afghanistan has never had much heavy industry before, it has little or no history of environmental protection either. “The big question is, can this be developed in a responsible way, in a way that is environmentally and socially responsible?” Mr. Brinkley said. “No one knows how this will work.”

With virtually no mining industry or infrastructure in place today, it will take decades for Afghanistan to exploit its mineral wealth fully. “This is a country that has no mining culture,” said Jack Medlin, a geologist in the United States Geological Survey’s international affairs program. “They’ve had some small artisanal mines, but now there could be some very, very large mines that will require more than just a gold pan.”

The mineral deposits are scattered throughout the country, including in the southern and eastern regions along the border with Pakistan that have had some of the most intense combat in the American-led war against the Taliban insurgency.

_________________
"The love that you withhold is the pain that you carry lifetime after lifetime," Alex


Mon Jun 14, 2010 9:31 am
Profile
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 9:38 pm
Posts: 2535
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Bluebonnet wrote:
Quote:
I disagree. The main reason we see each other as separate is because we choose to.

It's a choice.


I'm just as guilty of this as the next person, too, and I hate it! When I find myself salivating over the latest "toy" I am beginning to ask why? Why do I need this? Does it bring joy in my life?

Most of the time the answer is no. Sadly, I realize I've fallen for some "marketing" scheme by a large corporation to make me part with my hard earned money and join the sheeple herd, AGAIN! :yamon

So I purchase this little gizmo and what happens? I immediately feel "superior" to the have nots because you see this little gizmo makes me a have. Because I am a have I can then look down on the have nots and gaily sing "I got mine!"

Nah ne nah ne boo boo! :sarcasism


You know..I'd say I've been most fortunate, I've never felt that way. I've collected things from around the world that are most famous, most valuable and most rare, only so, that I can share them with those who've not had the oppotunity to see the things up close for themselves.
I've had a magical ability bestowed that mainly I learned to use for mine and others education.
The ET's have had a lot of influence with this.

Dex

_________________
"The love that you withhold is the pain that you carry lifetime after lifetime," Alex


Mon Jun 14, 2010 9:40 am
Profile
GT Truther

Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2009 1:49 pm
Posts: 685
Location: Wisconsin
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
Dex, the thing that I like to collect the most is data! But, most of what I have found out like statues of aliens that were found in Mexico I can't even use to comparre B C the owners have coppy rights. I asked a famous person if I could use one of his pictures as a comparison with an alien pic and he said sure, for $500.00. People like that who can only think money are holding back knowledge.

_________________
the time traveler


Mon Jun 14, 2010 10:09 am
Profile
GT Truther
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 10, 2009 6:06 am
Posts: 640
Location: Music of the Spheres
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
:hmm :hmm :hmm Department of Hmmmm.... :hmm :hmm :hmm

Dex, you quoted the NYTimes story above on the discovery of a huge hoard of precious minerals in Afghanistan. Looks straightforward enough, doesn’t it?

However, when I looked at the Huffington Post earlier this morning, I was greeted by a huge front page headline “There’s Gold In Them Thar Hills!” etc that featured the NYT news story along with a lot of links to skeptical stories pointing out that the discovery has actually been known since 2007 – so why the big trumpeting now?

The Huffpost’s lead story artwork:
Image


I thought, wryly, hooray!the MSM is finally starting to ‘get it’ and greet big political stories with some of what-used-to-be-called journalistic integrity. I even tried to capture a screenshot (beyond my technical skills, I’m afraid) of that front page because it represented such a breakthrough in media consciousness.

Well.

By this afternoon, the entire story, all links to skeptics and more than 3,000 reader comments have been scrubbed from the HuffPost site. There’s zip. Nada. Story never happened, sheeple. Nothing to see....

Fortunately, in my fumbling attempts to get a screenshot, I accidentally saved one of their original stories, reproduced for your edification here below:

Here’s the link to the Foreign Policy article referenced below http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2010/06/14/say_what_afghanistan_has_1_trillion_in_untapped_mineral_resources
The other links, to U.S., British and Afghan geological sites are now coming up blank, but here they are as well:
http://pubs.usgs.gov/fs/2007/3063/fs2007-3063.pdf
http://www.bgs.ac.uk/afghanminerals/docs/RareMetals_A4.pdf
Also read: http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Huge-obstacles-seen-in-apf-4284156852.html?x=0


Huffington Post wrote:
Afghanistan’s ‘Vast Riches of Minerals’ Highlighted by Pentagon

Posted 6-14-10 7:42 a.m.

"The United States has discovered nearly $1 trillion in untapped mineral deposits in Afghanistan, far beyond any previously known reserves and enough to fundamentally alter the Afghan economy and perhaps the Afghan war itself, according to senior American government officials," the New York Times' James Risen reported on Monday.

The previously unknown deposits -- including huge veins of iron, copper, cobalt, gold and critical industrial metals like lithium -- are so big and include so many minerals that are essential to modern industry that Afghanistan could eventually be transformed into one of the most important mining centers in the world, the United States officials believe.

Yet Blake Hounshell of Foreign Policy magazine sounds some notes of skepticism about the Times report, coming as it does after an array of grim news reports about the status of the Afghan war.
Read a little more carefully, though, and you realize that there's less to this scoop than meets the eye. For one thing, the findings on which the story was based are online and have been since 2007, courtesy of the U.S. Geological Survey. More information is available on the Afghan mining ministry's website, including a report by the British Geological Survey (and there's more here). You can also take a look at the USGS's documentation of the airborne part of the survey here, including the full set of aerial photographs.


Nowhere have I found that $1 trillion figure mentioned, which Risen says was generated by a Pentagon task force looking to help the Afghan government develop its resources (looking at the chart accompanying the article, though, it appears to be a straightforward tabulation of the total reserve figures for each mineral times current the current market price). According to Risen, that task force has begun prepping the mining ministry to start soliciting bids for mineral rights in the fall.


Indeed, opponents of the war have questioned whether Monday's Times story is the Pentagon's latest attempt to persuade an increasingly frustrated American public that Afghanistan is worth the costs in blood and treasure.

The Times story notes that an "internal Pentagon memo" asserted that Afghanistan could become "the 'Saudi Arabia of lithium,' a key raw material in the manufacture of batteries for laptops and Blackberries," and also features an interview with Gen. David Petraeus in which he claims of Afghanistan, "There is stunning potential here."


Stunning potential, indeed. To:

• Prolong and expand the war?
• Declare the minerals etc to be a ‘strategic interest’ of the U.S.?
• Award the mining rights to American interests?
• Face off with those pesky Russians –who apparently discovered the stuff in the first place – for another round of Cold Wars?

Yes, indeed, the beat goes on. :popcorn :popcorn :popcorn

Cheers,
Selene


Mon Jun 14, 2010 1:52 pm
Profile
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 8:54 am
Posts: 4711
Location: Canada
Post Re: The Golden Thread, Volume 2010 5.4
I saw the exact same headlines @ the Huff Post Selene and I posted the Huff Post story here,

viewtopic.php?f=43&t=2036

They rotate that banner a few times a day, the story is still there although the BIG headline is mising from the front page.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/06/1 ... 10869.html

_________________
Image
Image Please Obey the Golden Rules viewtopic.php?f=31&t=3563&p=40912#p40912


Mon Jun 14, 2010 2:05 pm
Profile WWW
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 904 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18 ... 37  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by Vjacheslav Trushkin for Free Forums/DivisionCore.